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For god sakes, do NOT keep BUMP KEYS on your KEY RING!


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#1 PhreeX

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Posted 11 June 2007 - 05:51 PM

Dunna if this has been addressed but a search didn't pull up anything ...

A post I will be making involves a fried that I sold a set of 3 keys to (I made copies and sold him the SC1, SC4, KW1 - I only charged him for the cost of the copying, I didn't profit off this deal as this is a good friend) ... anyway, he figured the best place for the keys was on his KEY CHAIN - I mean, how many cops look at all the keys on your key chain, when you get pulled over, and how many would know it was a bump key ... but when he was pulled over he had the misfortune of:

1) Having a conviction for B&E (back when he was 19, he is 31 now)

And worse

2) the cop that pulled him over was one of the law enforcement officers that the local media had been pimping out to expose this "new" method that allows "burglars to enter your house in only seconds and not leave any signs of hoe they got in" (these stories are a damn plaque with EVERY MEDIA OUTLET - TV, Print, Electronic/Online, etc..)

3) There have been a rash of bump-key breaking in this area, and I blame the media for that ... they have been busting young teenagers for these crimes. and I strongly feel if not for the media attention these kids would go back to breaking windows or looking for unlocked doors/windows...

And my friend had no intent of breaking into anything, rather he just wanted to show friends, family how easy it would be for someone to break in and would recommend things like deadbolts that can only be locked from the inside (no keyhole on the outside) ... and yes, he liked to use his new tools to show off to the party kids his newest "trick" ..

He was arrested, and he would have gone free if the one cop that seemed to be the expert in bump-keys had not pulled him over (busted tail light) ... he had all keys filed down for minimal-movement and in Florida it seems that, while I couldn't fine any cited precedent or any laws against it, he was charged with "possession of burglary tools" and was taken to jail ....

I post the story to remind people to NOT KEEP BUMP KEYS ON THEIR KEY RING!

Also, flaunting this "trick" at parties can seem kinda stupid as you then become the guy everyone knows as "that guy that can break into your house and you may never know it" ...

Please, keep the keys locked up at home...

Part of my jobs necessitates I use the keys, but I keep them in my apartment and in an envelope marked "FOR EMERGENCY LOCKOUTS ONLY" ...

Just trying to keep ya guys from suffering legal problems when I gather most of the people here are NOT getting their keys to go on house-breaking sprees ... my friend was not using his keys to break into anyone property, on the contrary, he was trying to showing friends and family how vulnerable they are ...

Please, your keyring you carry with you all the time is NOT THE PLACE for bump keys, especially if you have filed them!

Just trying to help... sorry if this have been posted before...

Oh, my friend (call him "Jeff") is being held on $21,000 bond ...

Be safe and use these tools for LEGAL PURPOSES ... I don't want to see sites like bumpkey.us and herehereherehereherehere.com shut down because of the idiot actions of a few...

//p

#2 Rigt-Lobe

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Posted 11 June 2007 - 07:26 PM

Damn...good post bro.

#3 theopratr

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Posted 11 June 2007 - 10:09 PM

Listen to the man, for he is wise.

Bump keys are tools... store them as such.

And does anyone remember James Bond being at a party and coming out with the phrase, "Hey, check out my cool new Walther PPK?"

A healthy dose of discretion is advised.

#4 PhreeX

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Posted 12 June 2007 - 12:38 AM

Damn...good post bro.

Just trying to keep my fellow bumpers safe... I mean, seems like a harmless thing .... say you and your friend go our for an evening, you both live in the same apartment, or have the same lock, so hey, perhaps you would have an SC1 or KW1 bump key on your keyring ... now I admit it, I have had my runs in with the law and in my youth (I was 19) I made a stupid mistake and got in trouble,... thankfully adjudication was withheld on all charges so I can honestly say "I have never been convicted of as felony" - still, when a cop pulls me over the past arrest (over a decade old) still shows,and this leads to the officer ALWAYS calling for 3 or 4 3extra cars for backup, ALWAYS asking me if they can search, and when I say "no" they do the ole "well if you have nothing illegal why not let me have a look" bit... but NEVER have I had a cop check out all of my keys, then again, this explosion of bump-keys in the local media may change things .. then again, I have never been arrested for any property crimes like my friend was ...

I HONESTLY think it will only be a matter of time before a filed bump-key is AUTOMATICALLY considered a "burglary tool" ... not sure if they could get you for having an unfiled one as if you had a lock with the pins at the "9999" depth then it would be a working key for that lock ...

//p
!

#5 Customer Support

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Posted 12 June 2007 - 01:36 AM

in Florida it seems that, while I couldn't fine any cited precedent or any laws against it, he was charged with "possession of burglary tools" and was taken to jail ....



We've talked this matter over heavily with our attorneys. While I'm not able to give specific information for obvious legal reasons, I would like to offer this link to you. I would suggest having a read - it will really shed some light on the matter at hand.

Take a look here: http://www.floridasu...4/ops/93592.pdf

"Section 810.06, Florida Statutes (1995), provides:
Whoever has in his possession any tool, machine,
or implement with intent to use the same, or allow the
same to be used, to commit any burglary or trespass shall
be guilty of a felony of the third degree, punishable as
provided in s. 775.082, s. 775.083, or s. 775.084."

" In order for the State to establish that the screwdriver was a burglary tool, the State needed to adduce testimony showing that the defendant used, or actually intended to use, the screwdriver to commit a burglary or trespass"


I would tell 'Jeff' to hire an attorney.

James K. - Lead Support
For Order specific questions please use the 'contact us' link at the top of our store.


#6 PhreeX

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Posted 12 June 2007 - 01:52 AM

We've talked this matter over heavily with our attorneys. While I'm not able to give specific information for obvious legal reasons, I would like to offer this link to you. I would suggest having a read - it will really shed some light on the matter at hand.

I worked in a law firm clerking and have a copy of the Florida Statues on CD, this was one of the first things in read when looking into this ...

Thanks though!

Take a look here: http://www.floridasu...4/ops/93592.pdf

"Section 810.06, Florida Statutes (1995), provides:
Whoever has in his possession any tool, machine,
or implement with intent to use the same, or allow the
same to be used, to commit any burglary or trespass shall
be guilty of a felony of the third degree, punishable as
provided in s. 775.082, s. 775.083, or s. 775.084."

" In order for the State to establish that the screwdriver was a burglary tool, the State needed to adduce testimony showing that the defendant used, or actually intended to use, the screwdriver to commit a burglary or trespass"

See, it gets a bit hazy here... if they pull you over at 3am and in your car they see a crowbar, screwdriver, gloves, bolt cutters, etc... well, that would easily be burglary tools .. but having a key on your key chain - IF THEY EVEN NOTICED - most cops wouldn't know what it was ...

And back to my original point - if the tip and shoulder isn't filed, well, it is just a key cut to a depth of 9 on all points, and if you had a lock with the pins set to that depth, it would be a perfectly working house key ...

I got bored a couple hours ago and actually took apart a lock (actually two as I needed the correct sized pins) and built a Kwikset lock with the pins set to a depth of 9999, and sure enough, when I simply inserted the bump key an just turned it, it opened ...

I dunna, since I was 14 (and picked my first lock with a lockpick set I bought at a Gun Show) I was hooked... and locks/keys still fascinate me to now end ...

But really, please, as others have said, "bump keys" are TOOLS and they are not meant to be on your key ring nest to your house key and some cheesy key ring charm!

I would tell 'Jeff' to hire an attorney.

Yeah, he is still in jail as he doesn't even have the $2,010 to post his 10% and get out ...

This is the first such case I have heard of (someone getting pulled over for a broken light and getting arrested for 3 keys on their key ring as "burglary tools" - of course his past record doesn't help.

As bad as I feel for him, things like this will put a negative like on great sellers like bumpkey.us ... who knows how long before police are told to check drivers keychains for bump keys?

//p

#7 BLK

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Posted 12 June 2007 - 11:35 AM

http://www.bumpkeyfo...light=cops took

Here is an earlier thread...

Popo has to prove intent to use, else every person with a screw driver in there car would go to jail.

Best advise: If you are not a locksmith, leave your bump keys at home.
Bump it to the next level.

#8 theopratr

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Posted 12 June 2007 - 02:25 PM

And if you can't stand to be without your bump keys, keep them in a locked tool box. I'm pretty sure that in most municipalities it's against your search and seizure rights to have an officer demand that you open your locked toolbox. Additionally, it's not unusual for a toolbox to be locked, as tools are not cheap. Obviously I would open the toolbox if it was requested... once they find that it's full of tools and not your collection of cocaine, human body parts and unregistered handguns, chances are you'll be left alone.

So, in any case, as it has been repeated time and again... these bump keys are tools, please store them as such to avoid unjust persecution!

#9 PhreeX

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Posted 12 June 2007 - 03:30 PM

BLK - Sorry for making something of a double post, I couldn't find that thread ... probably bad search terms.. As for the terms of his arrest, in short I think it is because he had a past conviction for burglary, the keys were modified, and the cop was the cop that if you watch central Florida New Stations, well, it is the SAME GUY that is the "bump key expert" that regards ALL BUMP KEYS as having only one use - to break into someones property! When he gets out I will read over the charges filed against him ..

theopratr - So where would you recommend one store all their drugs, body parts, and unlicensed handguns? ... j/k ;)

//p

#10 theopratr

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Posted 12 June 2007 - 04:30 PM

I don't do drugs, my firearms are all registered... but as for those pesky, errant body parts, those are occasionally unavoidable... all I can say is make sure you have a good chemical company that is willing and able to overnight you 50 kg buckets of lye, no questions asked. Keeping trophies is a terrible idea! :wink:

#11 Gobias

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Posted 13 August 2007 - 11:07 AM

So, in any case, as it has been repeated time and again... these bump keys are tools, please store them as such to avoid unjust persecution!


They are tools, but how are we supposed to store them so we can use them quickly in an emergency?

#12 redryan243

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Posted 15 September 2007 - 01:25 PM

They are tools, but how are we supposed to store them so we can use them quickly in an emergency?


sorry to bump an old thread, but i just wanted to put an idea out there. I am probably going to keep mine on a keyring, but not the keyring i carry aroung with me. I will just put them somewhere that i know where they are and can easily access them. This will keep you covered in case you get pulled over it is less suspicious than having 11 keys sitting there beside you you just have a second keyring which is not that odd for most people.
If you have a smarter cop then you can always get caught but taking certain precautions like not always having them, putting them with your spare tire in your trunk, and other things will greatly lower your risk of any misunderstandings with the 5-0

#13 BLK

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Posted 15 September 2007 - 06:17 PM

sorry to bump an old thread, but i just wanted to put an idea out there. I am probably going to keep mine on a keyring, but not the keyring i carry aroung with me. I will just put them somewhere that i know where they are and can easily access them. This will keep you covered in case you get pulled over it is less suspicious than having 11 keys sitting there beside you you just have a second keyring which is not that odd for most people.
If you have a smarter cop then you can always get caught but taking certain precautions like not always having them, putting them with your spare tire in your trunk, and other things will greatly lower your risk of any misunderstandings with the 5-0


Keep us updated on how that works for you. Obviously, you have it all figured out and you are much smarter than popo.
Bump it to the next level.

#14 jayweston

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Posted 02 December 2008 - 01:12 PM

You guys are acting like it is illegal to have bump keys. Heck it is not even illegal to use bump keys.

I was flying to visit my girlfriend a few months after september 11 and since I was only going to be in town for the weekend I only took a carry-on bag. Long story short my bag got flagged during the x-ray machine. It was taken them a while to find what they wanted so I told them that I had my lockpick set in there and showed them where it was at and they didn't even care that I had it on me. They ended up taking away my leatherman that was in the bag, but I got to take the lockpick set on the plane with me.

I have been caught on private property with my lockpick set on my and the cops didn't care. Whenever they ask me about it I explain that I volunteer for the local search and rescue orginization and as such I thought it was nessisary to have these tools and know how to use them. I also show them my membership to The Open Organisation Of Lockpickers.

I keep a small set of bump keys on my keychain and some homemade lockpicks in my wallet and I have never had a problem. And you shouldn't if you are not doing anything illegal or are not a prick to the police officer.

#15 MrLocks

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Posted 12 February 2011 - 01:44 AM

You have done a great job by posting such a good information. good work and thanks for sharing the good knowledge.
Sandy

#16 redcity

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 05:50 AM

Oh Lord. What a bad luck, thanks for reminding us of how small mistakes can lead to disasters. Great post ..



#17 LockPickIt

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Posted 14 December 2015 - 10:05 PM

Great and well written post. Thanks for this info, bro.



#18 LogiGoi

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Posted 15 December 2015 - 07:11 AM

Too long post but certainly worth it to read...I feel bad about your friend...I'm wondering if without a bail, how long is he going to stay in jail???sometimes some laws are so lame...