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Bumping without a Bump Key


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#21 Roman

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Posted 06 June 2007 - 11:14 PM

I guess this is partly debunked... but only partly... It makes me wonder. Since in this case, the bump key doesn't open the lock, but it can merely _push_ the pins to the shear line and they stick and it opens... ...would it be possible to have a key or set of keys that could just push the pins up to the shear line? ...I guess that takes it a little closer to lockpicking and in this case picking them might just be more efficient, if a bit more "suspicious" looking...
It would bypass the whole bumping principle, but still use a key-device to open the lock.

If you somehow managed to raise the angles of the peaks a bit, just enough so that they push the pins higher, but still allow the key to go in and out, you could make a key or set of keys that could work like that without bumping, just pushing up the pins til they stick. Such a key or keys would be junk for actual bumping, but would allow this "method" to work...

...or maybe some device that fits into a keyway and then has extendable things that push each of the pins up, and then releases them slowly, so you can torque it and they stick... I don't even know how I'd go about building that, but it sounds interesting.. Though again, lockpicking would be more efficient probably. Now I'm just on a train of thought.

Another thing, this works fine on my Kwikset, which is the cheapest lock I could find. In a way, this is functionally the opposite of bumping in that it would work better on the cheap locks with loose tolerances than in expensive, smooth running locks that make bumping easier. Or so it seems.

#22 lancen833

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Posted 09 June 2007 - 05:40 PM

Hmmm, what you're describing there sounds like a pick gun. Those things'll get a lock open mighty quick, but they aren't very discreet and if you aren't careful they can shred the lock.

I've found a few more locks around town that this works on. It seems to work on about 70% of the Masterlocks I come up against. I'm probably just lucky.

#23 Roman

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Posted 09 June 2007 - 11:58 PM

I've found a few more locks around town that this works on. It seems to work on about 70% of the Masterlocks I come up against. I'm probably just lucky.


wow. I guess it depends on the amount of pins and variance in cuts and height of peaks... i think it'd be a better technique on a 4pin M1 than a 5pin KW1 ...

...but that's assuming I have the general principle right... I have little practice on my Master. I cut the M1 way too low and it doesn't even push the pins up. A legitimate fuck up on my part. I just need to copy the original and try again... or buy blanks and a square file.

Hey, if it really works on 70% of locks, then spectacular, cause it's a lovely, quiet way to get the lock open.

#24 lancen833

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Posted 14 June 2007 - 11:47 PM

Definitely a wonderful way to get locks open. I had a blast tonight when I happened upon like 8 locks that I had yet to open. Out of the eight, one did not unlock, but I suspect that to be more because of rust than the pins.

The sad thing is that I'm doing this in completely public areas, and people don't even give me a second look. They see key+lock=open lock and suspect nothing. Then again, I'm not taking the locks or anything so I'm not sure if what I am doing is even wrong.

#25 skip 2 my lou

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Posted 16 June 2007 - 02:42 AM

In my limited trials of the master lock, it matters very litttle what technique is used. Most master locks are so easy the variations to opening the lock are almost endless. I'm curious if this key opens a wide variety of master locks. The one thing that seems to ruin a bumpkey is making the cuts to deep. With a few stokes of the file, a good "ugly" key is useless if the cuts are too deep.

#26 theopratr

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Posted 16 June 2007 - 08:57 AM

The one thing that seems to ruin a bumpkey is making the cuts to deep. With a few stokes of the file, a good "ugly" key is useless if the cuts are too deep.


I disagree, sir. As long as your peaks are at the proper angles and intervals, the actual groove depth shouldn't have any effect on the opening of the lock at all; if cut past the lowest cut, none of the pins will even end up touching the grooves.

Obviously there are limitations on how deep the grooves can be as a result of the peaks being angled properly, but aside from that, I generally think that deeper is better.

#27 skip 2 my lou

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Posted 16 June 2007 - 06:31 PM

I was thinking along the same principles as you. My groove placement was good, maybe when i increased the groove depth it threw off the angle. All I know is I had a good key, pushed the depths to the limit, and the key went in the trash. Directly after that I stopped exactly at the depth of my factory key and it worked well. My point was, when dealing with the old master, depth is more important that groove placement. I can make an ugly key in less than 10 min, and it works perfectly.

#28 lancen833

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Posted 17 June 2007 - 09:12 AM

I'm pretty sure that the valley depth doesn't have very much importance outside of being low enough so that all the pins contact. The real importance lies in how smooth your slopes are and how precise your spacing is.If you have those right, it doesn't matter how much lower your key can go, it will bump.

#29 Synthead

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Posted 31 March 2008 - 03:13 AM

I am able to bump via this method with a true bump key! I have been able to do it on all of the locks I've tried it with, but unfortunately, the rough contact areas between the key and the lock needed to do this wear down after a couple dozen bumps and I can't do it on the lock anymore. But I made a video bumping a lock this way. It's uploading right now, I'll post a link when it's done!

#30 Synthead

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Posted 31 March 2008 - 03:27 AM



There ya go

#31 Synthead

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Posted 31 March 2008 - 05:11 AM

Getting better!



#32 jacksilver

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Posted 05 November 2008 - 03:03 PM

Bumping without a bump key is like fighting without a weapon, it reminds me bruce lee's movie. I like the concept! :fighting:
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#33 ChicagoLocks

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Posted 15 February 2011 - 11:25 PM

Bumping without a bump key is like fighting without a weapon, it reminds me bruce lee's movie. I like the concept! :fighting:

yeah, thats true its like a fighting without weapon, bump key the most important weapon in bumping fight.
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